7/12/2009                                                                                       View Comments

Does this make sense to you? It makes sense to Christians!

By Neal Stone

Candied ChildImage by Sir_Robin12 via Flickr

You have two children. A son and a daughter. You place a bowl of candy in front of them and tell them not to touch it. You leave the room. They give in and eat the candy, you come in and not only punish them but their children as well who weren't even involved.

Does this make sense to you? It makes sense to Christians!

Your children now have a large family and many of them disagree with you and refuse to live by your rules. You get angry and dig a series of large pits and throw many of these children into the pits and bury them alive.

Does this make sense to you? It makes sense to Christians!

You have an enemy who challenges one of your children's belief in you. To prove yourself and your child's belief you kill all the child's offspring, destroy his property and make him sick with boils and suffer great agony all to prove a bet. On top of that this enemy can talk to you face to face, but your own creation can not because they once obeyed this enemy.

Does this make sense to you? It makes sense to Christians!

The idea the earth and the universe were created from gases the existed forever and exploded is false, yet the idea that a god who existed forever just spoke it all into existence is true.

Does this make sense to you? It makes sense to Christians!

God who is so powerful he not only spoke the universe into existence but can control the most absolute smallest particle and yet his solution for mans plight is to be born of a virgin so he can grow up and be killed by his own creation.

Does this make sense to you? It makes sense to Christians!

Instead of pushing man to better fulfillment and a brighter future, god instead pushes to end it all in a most horrible manner all because he lost control a long time ago.

Does this make sense to you? It makes sense to Christians!

God has a war with his worst enemy and yet he doesn't destroy him nor locks him up in prison but instead he releases him to roam the galaxy freely so he can cause countless problems. But it's ok, god will get him someday. (wolf, wolf)

Does this make sense to you? It makes sense to Christians!

You are not to think for yourselves or about what you believe, but rather just have faith in the Bible and what the preachers teach you without question.

Does this make sense to you? It makes sense to Christians!

You pray and ask god to answer even though he rarely answers you or anyone, but you are just to have faith and keep believing regardless of the lack of response from god.

Does this make sense to you? It makes sense to Christians!

When you really sit down and use your brain, Christianity does not make sense. We have a shot to build a better world, but god and his followers want it to end. It's all senseless. I was once a Christian and believed all that above and yet somehow it made sense to me at the time.

Then I started to think...

24 comments:

webmdave said...

i so agree i was once a christian and i also one day started to think.
athiesm is not a belief system but a understanding and acceptance of life living a and death.

webmdave said...

I'm not a Christian but the idea of some meaning to this life is more comforting then believing in nothing. If everyone did what they want all the time w out a feeling of remorse or sorrow then I guess call me a Christian because I'd want this world to end as well. The whole point of Christianity isn't to control the masses, its for real people who want to experience a real way of life Not a false reality of constant demoralizing actions. Most people frown upon Christianity because they wont be able to continue their selfish lives and may have to grow up. But your right, believing in nothing has a much brighter outlook for most fake people..

webmdave said...

If you are not a Christian, then how do you know what meaning Christianity gives to people's lives? I used to be a Christian and Christianity brought a very negative meaning to my life. And Christianity says that if I want to find a new meaning that is better for me personally then I will roast in hell for eternity. Threats do not make a belief system more meaningful. Threats just make it harder to leave.

Do you think that all Jews, Hindus, Moslems, agnostics, atheists, etc. do whatever they want to without a feeling of remorse. That is patently absurd.

Most people do not frown upon Christianity because they won't be able to continue their selfish lives. How selfish is it to believe that you are specially chosen and everyone else is going to hell? Christianity often promotes a sense of selfishness and superiority. Everyone ele is wrong and roasting and I am right and going to be dancing and singing in heaven while everyone else is being eternally puished. God loves me and hates you.

As for growing up, to know that you have much in common with all the other people in humanity of all religions or lack thereof; and to know that you must accomplish what you can in this lifetime and not wait for an invisible guy to solve all your problems; and to believe what you believe out of a desire to know truth all sound very grown up to me.

Many of the people who have left Christianity do not "believe in nothing." They believe in something that is not nearly as degrading, dehumanizing and destructive as most forms of Christianity are. Whatever path each exChristian has chosen, and for many that is agnosticism and for others deism or a more generalized belief in God or, like myself, atheism it has been chosen from a thoughtful, truth seeking place. Unlike most Christians, most of us are willing to change our minds about what we believe should the evidence prove our personal insights to be incorrect.

webmdave said...

@ Evens_art,

I was prepared to shred you a new one, but I see that Renoliz has, point-by-point, corrected you. Kudos to her.

And FYI, even if we could stretch our imaginations to believe that "Chrisitianity" and its blatant favoritism and compuslory "love" provides a "brighter outlook", that doesn't means its "true". See non sequitur.

webmdave said...

Thanks Boom, I was on a roll! :)

webmdave said...

Unlike Christians who try to conform like robots to one mould, atheists have an infinite variety of options available to them.

Christians looove to harp on and on about how Nazis and Communists are atheists. But i wonder just *who Hitler and Stalin got their inquisition-style tactics from. Witch hunts. Show trials (ordeals, anyone?). Persecution. Particularly relentless persecution of heretics and apostates. Hmm...

On the other hand, you'll find atheists in all kinds of worthy causes (instead of dancing around wasting time worshipping some nonexistent prick). You'll find progressives, humanists, activists, scientists, lawyers... All making a *positive difference to the bloody world out there instead of trying to end it.

webmdave said...

Well Boom', you might also have to account for the MOOD I was in at the time to.

Honestly, after re-reading what batcavejanitor wrote, it's obvious that his sentence structure, can lead one to two possible interpretations....Oddly enough, just like most bible verses can.

When I replied to him, I really had thought he meant to say that all his prayers had been answered, and it seems I wasn't alone in seeing his words in that light.

ATF (Who's been fighting far too many fundies online, as of late)

webmdave said...

flipps

I have, and still am struggling with Question of ultimate concern, but I don't see any intellectual integrity in ridicule and mockery.Yes there are ridiculous things done and said in the name of Religion, but please let's have a respectful debate?Besides I think being human in itself is a rich enough source for laughter!?

Wait -- if I find your beliefs absurd, why should I respect them?

If I feel like ridiculing you for your asinine beliefs your parameters are not going to stop me.

I can tolerate your beliefs. You can run around, naked, on all fours, howling at the moon-god, for all I care -- knock yourself out, but I can surely comment on what I conclude to be ridiculous beliefs and I can use ridicule and mockery to my heart's delight.

I've concluded it is amazingly preposterous and NOT worthy of respect for a person to worship an invisible deity, in the sky and believing that a dead man (schizophrenic god/son) can come back to life, good as new, after being buried for three days and this some how magically altered sin so that if you want to get saved you simply let god know, telepathically, that you believe in him and accept him and then he won't torture you in the flames of hell for an eternity for what is sure to be the most evil, sadistic and vile sin -- unbelief. (massive sarcasm)

I laugh in your general direction.

But by all means, please, let us know what you think it is ALL about and I promise to keep my incivility to a minimum.

--S.

webmdave said...

ATF

Stop being a dick. He didn't mean that all of his prayers had been answered, but that he goes regardless of whether or not some preacher told him and whether or not all of his prayers are answered.

Right -- he's going to church because he is a deluded dick.

--S.

webmdave said...

ATF

Stop being a dick. He didn't mean that all of his prayers had been answered, but that he goes regardless of whether or not some preacher told him and whether or not all of his prayers are answered.

Right -- he's going to church because he is a deluded dick.

--S.

webmdave said...

Note: Isn't it funny how xtians don't do sarcasm or parody, well at all?

Batcavejanitor ,

It is not out of the question, for a fundie xtian to make a claim that god has answered 'all their prayers'. Meaning, personal interest prayers, not world peace type of prayers.

Therefore, whether you meant to say god answers all your prayers or not, it would come as no surprise to see a xtian make such a claim on this website, as they have on many others that I frequent.

ATF (Who learned that assumptions are easily made about a person, by the group of people [or theology stance] that you hang with)

webmdave said...

I considered doing the "barking-dog" impression video, but thought it might upset "terms of use" and so decline.
Also was concerned that any visiting Pagans would complain at my mocking of Moon Deity.
Perhaps one of the most concerning aspect of being an ex-Christian is "confessing" to have been fooled for so many years.I can't even claim it was due to upbringing, since neither Parents were Believers as such.As for School, well, here in U.K during 60's&70's there was for me a nominal Church-of-England "Culture",but honestly so very vague.I am only truly considering at THIS MOMENT what effect subconsciously School Assemblies had upon me ages 5-16yrs old!
During my "conversion experience" suddenly/apparently an explanation of the Gospel Message caused a comprehension of what before were barely understood Hymns in archaic language.Uh oh! seem to have gone into Biography-Mode!!

webmdave said...

I considered doing the "barking-dog" impression video, but thought it might upset "terms of use" and so decline.
Also was concerned that any visiting Pagans would complain at my mocking of Moon Deity.
Perhaps one of the most concerning aspect of being an ex-Christian is "confessing" to have been fooled for so many years.I can't even claim it was due to upbringing, since neither Parents were Believers as such.As for School, well, here in U.K during 60's&70's there was for me a nominal Church-of-England "Culture",but honestly so very vague.I am only truly considering at THIS MOMENT what effect subconsciously School Assemblies had upon me ages 5-16yrs old!
During my "conversion experience" suddenly/apparently an explanation of the Gospel Message caused a comprehension of what before were barely understood Hymns in archaic language.Uh oh! seem to have gone into Biography-Mode!!

webmdave said...

My mind is far from shut-off, O.k, but a too-open mind can swallow all kinds of half-truths and junk-i should know! having debated Hari-Krishnas,Moonies,T.M-ers,Ufologists-and more during my late teens.Oh what fun!(at least Bahai's appeared to make more sense)
Having said that, De Omnibus Dubitandum(doubt everything) was also a watchword, heck! maybe I am/was Schizophrenic after all!
Seriously though, I do suffer from "mild" depression and FM,but am disclosing far too much personal stuff here.Nuff said.

webmdave said...

Being open minded doesn't mean you believe anything and everything, it just means your willing to think and explore. A mind which " swallows all kinds of half-truths" is a naive mind, not an open mind. What is a "half-truth" anyway? Sounds like an oxymoron.
Many christians suffer from various degrees of schizophrenia. A religion that requires one to shut off or hide a portion of ones personality inevitably leads to a split mind.
I also went through a period of testing various religions when I was a teen, it never caused me to believe in those organizations. I was able to keep my "freewill" so when others fall for their BS, I consider them naive. Anyone should be able to research these organizations without fear.
It seems to me that doubting everything is akin to going through life without any passion or joy. It's just as bad as believing everything.
You don't have an open mind if you enter a thought with pre-existing doubt.
This is only a guess but it sounds like your fed up with organized religion.
You should read some of the older posts here, you might find there are many others here who have traveled a similar path as you.

webmdave said...

I don't get why religion gets such a special pass.

**
Exhibit A: non-sequitur cartoon. 2 cavemen, A and B, are standing in the rain.

A: It raining.

B: No it not.

A: Yes it is. See water? Rain!

B: No it not.

A: Ohhh my head hurt.

**

Exhibit B: teacher and student

Teacher: Danae, why haven't you submitted your assignment?

Student: My religion forbids me to do homework.

Teacher: Well, i guess i can't impose on your belief system then. [moves on without further comment]

***

Xtians are only too quick to ridicule "cultists", but fail to realise just how goofy their own stories are.

webmdave said...

Gah, can't reply to your reply, so I'll just reply back to this one ;)

You're right of course. To be fair, though, I was stating that from the Xtian perspective. You know how "God will always love us, and never leave us, and just wants us to turn back to him," yada yada blah-blah-blah...

webmdave said...

Not quite true. There is no evidence for the existence of tachyons (particles that can travel faster than light). So this is a pretty good analogy, and the theorists/philosophers who subscribe to the existence of tachyons are doing it on faith alone, not on any empirical evidence.

webmdave said...

I don't recall (and couldn't find) that quote you've attributed to one of very favorite authors, but I do recall this one: "“Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.” citation

I suppose, by your logic (and it's Pascal's Wager, btw), that people who leave and criticize Islam are still believers in Islam, and people who leave and criticize Mormonism are still believers in Mormonism? Really? Is that really the way it works?

Please read the disclaimer. We are EX-Christians, doofus. Waking up to the fact that you have been duped by a religious cult is extremely upsetting. This forum provides a place for the de-converting to blow off a little steam. If you don't like the rhetoric posted here -- CLICK OFF!!!

webmdave said...

A question, or many, to the savvy agnostics. One suggests they can not know or perhaps ever know of any concept, to include the concept of god, based on first principles or ultimate knowledge; in such a belief, one asserts a knowledged understanding for the terms god and ultimate knowledge - isn't this contradictory?

Let's assume the terms ultimate knowledge and god can be given imaginative or purely logical meaning, how does one suggest providing evidence to the contrary of one's imagination? If one does not have evidence for ultimate knowledge or a god corollary, then wouldn't all derivative 'beliefs', be entirely dependent on such unknowns or unknowable be defaulted to 'faith' based belief?

I'm under the impression, that to hold a belief while lacking evidence or in contrast to evidence is to hold a belief based on faith. Am I misguided in my thinking?

If the agnostic position must inherently require faith, then what distinguishes an agnostic theist from an agnostic atheist? How one chooses to brandish or apply their faith, one with a god, the other without?

If a person says they don't believe in the tooth fairy, does that require faith? No, if the term tooth fairy is propositionally invalid, because it lacks evidence, then a person is not 'obligated' to accept the term tooth fairy as propositionally meaningful, the lack of belief as a result or discarding such a proposition is not a belief position.

If a person says they don't believe the tooth fairy has blue socks on right now, does that require faith? Yes, someone has 'presupposed' the term tooth fairy to be propositionally valid, in order to promote a further belief regarding what color socks a tooth fairy would be wearing right now. The tooth fairy presupposition requires faith.

If a person says that ultimate knowledge is a necessary characteristic of god, does that require faith? Yes, someone has 'presupposed' the term ultimate knowledge to be propositionally valid, in order to promote a further belief regarding the caricature of a god. The ultimate knowledge presupposition requires faith.

It would appear, that the common element that allows agnosticism to be a valid adjective for both an atheist and a theist, is the element of faith.

Are 'faith' based beliefs considered to be default positions? If so, can we then assume that faith based theism, shares the default position with faith based atheism?

I was under the impression that the lack of belief in an unfounded proposition to be the default position. Can someone assist in clearing up my confusion?

webmdave said...

There is no cost to it, for now...

It always comes down to this with you people. Always. You really have nothing else.

webmdave said...

There is no cost to it, for now...

It always comes down to this with you people. Always. You really have nothing else.

webmdave said...

MaineIacinOR: Unsure of what exactly an Atheist could possibly obtain from casting stones about others' beliefs.

Easy answer.

The religious nuts, like YOUSELF, need to be stopped from influencing our school and government policies, be that at the Federal or State level, with your unsupported god drivel.

FYI: It's Dante's Hell....a FABLE, just like your bible book is mostly fable.

Only a damned fool is certain of anything

I suppose you aren't certain that Zeus and Thor were gods?
Do you worship them, just on the off-chance that they are the true gods and not your jesus?

As far as 'cost' goes....
How I wish sometimes that death had feedback.
Meaning, that you would still be quite dead in the ground, but some how be able to know that your god beliefs were totally unfounded and that you xtians wasted your lives kissing god's ass.

ATF

webmdave said...

XPD,

Well, the value of the bicuspid tooth, would depend if it has any GOLD or SILVER in it or not.
In that case, we ascertain the value based on precious metal content.

On the other hand XPD, if you're talking about a bicuspid that is laden with caries instead, I would suggest you stop by our ToothFairy Dental Store (Incorporated) and purchase our "Deluxe Bicuspid Porcelain Replacment Tooth"--- with built in AM/FM HI-Fidelity Radio Receiver; for all your private unholy listening needs.

ATF (Who wonders why his friend XPD, wants to rain down 'hail' on him )